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#279601 - 03/09/10 10:36 AM
live music on the increase but less places to play ??!!
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jack.plug
Be Nice (I'm New!)
Registered: 18/08/10
Posts: 35
Loc: UK
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People seem more into live music these days but with more and more pubs closing down there seems to be less places for the bands to play, this is such a shame. Or is it just my area.
Edited by jack.plug (03/09/10 12:49 PM)
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jack.plug
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#279605 - 03/09/10 04:18 PM
Re: live music on the increase but less places to play ??!!
[Re: jack.plug]
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OldSwanner
Professional Forumite!
Registered: 31/08/09
Posts: 139
Loc: Warwick, UK
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Smoking ban blew it for everyone. It's everywhere.
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#279611 - 04/09/10 01:32 AM
Re: live music on the increase but less places to play ??!!
[Re: OldSwanner]
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Lurcher
Professional Forumite!
Registered: 09/02/09
Posts: 899
Loc: Tipperary, Ireland
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Well lads, we've had the smoking ban a lot longer and pubs are struggling to stay open. But those offering live music, albeit at the entry level, seem to be weathering the storm better than the boring 'ale-houses'. This is especially so in rural areas.
Those venues that have large music rooms, and there are quite a lot in outlying areas, are attracting people with mini-bus services from the towns to attend their country music nights.
Of course, its always and only a mix of C&W and Country & Irish, which I can't bring myself to witness.
Just doing a head count, there are about 5 regular music places in Clonmel (p.20,000) and about 8 in the surrounding villages who share the dedicated fans with Friday, Saturday and Sunday gigs. I think our laws are a bit easier than UK regarding music venue licensing. You do still have that demarcation between solo/duo performance and bands, don't you?
Brian
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#279613 - 04/09/10 05:43 AM
Re: live music on the increase but less places to play ??!!
[Re: Lurcher]
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Druid
Professional Forumite!
Registered: 08/01/06
Posts: 268
Loc: Derby
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So far as I'm aware, as the law under the UK 2003 licensing act stands at the moment any form of live music that can be argued to be 'a public performance', be it a soloist or a band, needs to be licensed. Arguably this stupid --ooops naughty word-- regulation extends to anyone having an open door party for neighbours and having a spontaneous sing along.. as soon as the performance can be deemed to be 'public', if you haven't gone cap in and to the local licensing office wafting sheckles and application forms some jobsworth from the council could want their bureaucratic pound of flesh.
The demarcation between solo/duo performers that Lurcher referred to was, I believe, the two in bar exemption. This rule allowed for a solo or duet performance to take place without the need for the venue holder to have a licence. This exemption was unfortunately swallowed up in the 2003 act so now ALL performances require licensing. There is a move ongoing to introduce exemptions of live music licensing in venues of capacity of 200 or less and the reintroduction of the 2 in a bar exemption but as it stands playing live music of any sort to the public in an unlicensed venue can potentially lead to heavy fines for the individual musicians (up to 20K I think) and the venue proprieter. The onus is on the musician to ensure that the venue is licensed, not a consideration that comes to the front of my mind when I'm skint and a venue offers me 30 quid to do a 45 minute acoustic set.
Some are more laid back about it than others but as an indicator of how much local councils can misinterpret or be out of phase with the licensing act many authorities now claim that the law requires a license to busk. This is not the case as busking was clearly stated to be exempt from the provisions of the act by the department of culture and media at the time the act was entered onto the statute books. Anyway, all being well there will be some amendments and reintroductions of exemptions at some time in the not too distant future and hopefully the opportunities for us to perform live in public, be it for pleasure, cash, beer or any combination thereof will increase accordingly.
Edited by Druid (04/09/10 05:46 AM)
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#279614 - 04/09/10 05:52 AM
Re: live music on the increase but less places to play ??!!
[Re: Druid]
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Druid
Professional Forumite!
Registered: 08/01/06
Posts: 268
Loc: Derby
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p.s. More on whats happening re live music licensing can be found HERE 
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#279632 - 05/09/10 04:31 AM
Re: live music on the increase but less places to play ??!!
[Re: Druid]
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Danmeemusic a.k.a. BB
Forum Council Member
Old Timer
Registered: 02/01/02
Posts: 1898
Loc: Manchester or Shropshire
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What do you guys think about the money available at gigs? I'm frequently told oh, we don't have enough money to pay you. Or money for music comes from the bar money so we can only pay you £50 (total) or things like that. Also Pay-to-Play, I was asked about a month ago to do a "charity" gig in a couple weeks time. I actually ended up getting a phone call saying that the gig was off because of a disagreement with the band leader and the organiser, basically they refused to let us take cars anywhere near the location of the gig. Now, I would have been playing my double bass and because of my recent illness, can't really move that far without feeling exhausted, and the drummer is almost 80. So he declined on that basis. But it also transpired that they were asking him for money in order to play the gig. Given that it was a charity gig, I already understood that there would be no money, but I had no idea that it was pay-to-play. If I'd have known this, I'd have flatly refused to play in the first place. Has anyone else come across gigs like this? As I understand it, these are against the principals of the Musician's Union, so how venues manage to get away with these really gets to me. I'm trying to make a living playing music, and teaching music, and find it quite insulting that they think I should have to pay them to do my job. The amount of money available at many venues also gets to me quite a lot, I always get the distinct impression that they would rather take advantage of young kids (15-19) and not pay them at all, or barely anything than have decent, professional musicians playing gigs. Doesn't make it any easier.
RE smoking ban, the one thing I used to detest, as a non-smoker or former casual-smoker, was getting home from a gig and stinking of smoke. Especially when the carpet on my amp and my gig bags effectively soak up the smell, so I have to clean everything the next day. I hated it. I know that I'm gunna be stinking of sweat when I get home now, but that's easier to deal with than smoke I think. I much prefer gigging now to a couple years ago, much better environment I feel.
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#279634 - 05/09/10 06:31 AM
Re: live music on the increase but less places to play ??!!
[Re: stickyfiddle]
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Oldjono
Professional Forumite!
Registered: 15/09/09
Posts: 842
Loc: Dorset
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Forgive my ignorances, being a been a bit out of touch with live playing but within the licencing is there some form of duty to be paid to the PRS. In the bad old days you had to list your cover versions on a form at the bar, or somewhere. Is that stil the case or is it all covered by the licensee? Bit confused...
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#279636 - 05/09/10 07:47 AM
Re: live music on the increase but less places to play ??!!
[Re: Oldjono]
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Druid
Professional Forumite!
Registered: 08/01/06
Posts: 268
Loc: Derby
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I've never personally experienced a requirement to list covers or provide a set list. Having said that, the PRS extract a fee from anywhere where music is played publicly. there was a hoo haa not too long ago because they were threatening all sorts of people with law suits, e.g. guys in workshops listening to radio or cd players whilst they fixed your exhaust. Although the music wasn't there for the public benefit customers could overhear it so it followed that the premises had to be licensed by the PRS. It seems logical to assume therefore that any venue that is likely to have live music is also required to have a PRS licence and they probably have some formula for divvying those fees up without the requirement to be provided with a break down of every cover performed at each venue.
Edited by Druid (05/09/10 07:48 AM)
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#279637 - 05/09/10 09:25 AM
Re: live music on the increase but less places to play ??!!
[Re: Danmeemusic a.k.a. BB]
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OldSwanner
Professional Forumite!
Registered: 31/08/09
Posts: 139
Loc: Warwick, UK
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RE smoking ban, the one thing I used to detest, as a non-smoker or former casual-smoker, was getting home from a gig and stinking of smoke. Especially when the carpet on my amp and my gig bags effectively soak up the smell, so I have to clean everything the next day. I hated it. I know that I'm gunna be stinking of sweat when I get home now, but that's easier to deal with than smoke I think. I much prefer gigging now to a couple years ago, much better environment I feel.
?? you could have just made the choice to only play at non smoking gigs. Don't need a law that screws up everyone else for you to make that choice.
_________________________
Gibson Blueshawk Fender Blues Junior/Hotrod Deluxe http://www.psgt.co.uk ... *Real* tuition for serious guitar students in Leamington Spa and Warwick.
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